philosophy meta-forum

This ain't no straw man

Albertus

13 day(s) ago

In my experience there are two common ways of being unreasonable about this issue.

First, there are people who are so ideological that they put more weight on the testimony of women claiming to be harassed or assaulted than they do on other comparable sorts of testimony. I've found such people to be quite rare in the broader public but not uncommon in philosophy circles.

Second, there are people who are sexist and put less weight on the testimony of women claiming to be harassed or assaulted than they do on other comparable sorts of testimony. Such people are quite common in the broader public but uncommon in philosophy circles.

Sylvia

Third, there are people who are sexist and put less weight on the testimony of men claiming to be harassed or assaulted than they do on other comparable sorts of testimony. Such people are uncommon in the broader public but very common in philosophy circles.

Suzy

13 day(s) ago

I find it very difficult to believe that people "who are sexist and put less weight on the testimony of women claiming to be harassed or assaulted" are "quite common in the broader public" when I look at what is currently happening in the world.

Genevieve

13 day(s) ago

Don’t ask her for proof; instead ask yourself whether you have a credible reason for thinking that she is lying to you. If you can’t think of one—and you almost certainly won’t be able to—believe her.

There are lots of reasons why women lie about rape:

* some do it to cover up their infidelity

* some do it because they are mentally ill

* some do it because they feel guilty about a hookup

* some even do it because the sex was bad and 'they wouldn't have consented if they knew it would be bad'

* some do it to excuse their failures

* some do it for attention

* some do it for sympathy

* some do it to make their boyfriends jealous

* some do it for revenge

* some do it to get their rivals fired

* some do it for money

* some do it to score victimhood points in the SJW status hierarchy

Read more here.

Adelard

This is the most bizarre thing about the quote from Beebee and Widdows -why wouldn't you be able to think of a credible reason to think someone is lying about this, even aside from being mistaken?

Lucien

13 day(s) ago

Because they're misandrists, that's why.

Yohanan

10 day(s) ago

Joseph here.

Given all the combined evidence and context (benefits of lying for Moore, risks of telling the truth for accusers), including the credibility of the Washington Post, it seems to me that Moore is more likely to be lying, and his accusers more likely to be telling the truth. I wouldn't leave my teenager daughter alone with Moore, and I wouldn't vote for him.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/woman-shares-new-evidence-of-relationship-with-roy-moore-when-she- was-17/2017/12/04/0c3d1cde-d903-11e7-a841-2066faf731ef_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.f67e0748242a

Leslie

10 day(s) ago

benefits of lying for Moore, risks of telling the truth for accusers

You're forgetting the benefits of lying for the accusers. It's no coincidence that these accusations came out just as he was running for the Senate against the interests of both parties' establishments.

By your reasoning it follows that we should always believe the accusers just because there are 'risks'. What you advocate is called a witch hunt.

Frantisek

10 day(s) ago

I hereby accuse Joseph/Yohanan of being a child molester. I saw many incidents with my own eyes. I will give details if asked.

Just think of the risks is this is not taken seriously. Think of the children.

Also, I have no reason to lie. I don't have anything to gain. Nobody even knows my identity here. And clearly, I don't have any vendetta against Joseph. I don't even know Joseph in real life.

Therefore, everyone should believe me, track Joseph down, and work to expose and punish Joseph as a dangerous pedophile: a *predator*.

Right, Joseph/Yohanan?

Jacques

8 day(s) ago

I also believe that a giant teacup orbits the earth

Christine

I have a credible reason for thinking you're lying to me

Alexandre

7 day(s) ago

Leslie, saying that x, y, and z are jointly sufficient for believing p is not the same as saying that y by itself is always sufficient for belief that p. Come on, this is pretty basic stuff.

G.W.F.

7 day(s) ago

Any news on accused sexual harasser Justin Weinberg?

Epictetus

7 day(s) ago

Any news on accused sexual harasser Justin Weinberg?

G.W.F.

I know (or think I know?) that this whole thing is a joke, but Weinberg is actually pretty slimy in interactions with female grad students. It would not surprise me, or others who've seen him in action, if a series of real complaints emerged.

Felix

7 day(s) ago

I find it's very often that way, Epictetus, with people who champion crusades against some vice.

If I were a woman, I'd be especially wary of aggressive male feminists. There's a long history of such men taking quite remarkable liberties.

Diogenes

7 day(s) ago

Joseph here.

Given all the combined evidence and context (benefits of lying for Moore, risks of telling the truth for accusers), including the credibility of the Washington Post, it seems to me that Moore is more likely to be lying, and his accusers more likely to be telling the truth. I wouldn't leave my teenager daughter alone with Moore, and I wouldn't vote for him.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/woman-shares-new-evidence-of-relationship-with-roy-moore-when-she-was-17/2017/12/04/0c3d1cde-d903-11e7-a841-2066faf731ef_story.html?hpid=hp_hp- top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.f67e0748242a

Yohanan

Well, the good news then is that you really have nothing to fear: elections aren't real, your vote doesn't count, and politics is all bread and circus designed to give people the illusion that they're in control of society, when in fact we're all constantly being herded like cattle.

Werner

6 day(s) ago

I know (or think I know?)

Epictetus

Post an article about it in a journal or fuck off with this "knowledge" shit

P.S. contemporary epistemology is a joke

Werner

6 day(s) ago

Joseph here.

Given all the combined evidence and context (benefits of lying for Moore, risks of telling the truth for accusers), including the credibility of the Washington Post, it seems to me that Moore is more likely to be lying, and his accusers more likely to be telling the truth. I wouldn't leave my teenager daughter alone with Moore, and I wouldn't vote for him.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/woman-shares-new-evidence-of-relationship-with-roy-moore-when-she-was-17/2017/12/04/0c3d1cde-d903-11e7-a841-2066faf731ef_story.html?hpid=hp_hp- top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.f67e0748242a

Yohanan

Well, the good news then is that you really have nothing to fear: elections aren't real, your vote doesn't count, and politics is all bread and circus designed to give people the illusion that they're in control of society, when in fact we're all constantly being herded like cattle.

Diogenes

If Hillary had won, all of these pompous morons who will write "credibility of the Washington Post" without a moment of self-reflection would be trumpeting how great it is that we have another kind of rich weirdo calling the shots with executive orders, a mostly compliant legislative, and a judiciary that is all but indistinguishable from the administrative state that just does whatever it wants without a single fuck given for the popular will.

Any so-called philosopher that accepts this status quo as true, right or good is so divorced from reality that they have nothing interesting to say about ethics or politics. But this won't stop them from continuing to produce high-quality garbage and getting high-quality blowjobs* for the trouble.

* Blowjobs will not actually be of a high quality.

Muhammad

6 day(s) ago

I know (or think I know?)

Epictetus

Post an article about it in a journal or fuck off with this "knowledge" shit

P.S. contemporary epistemology is a joke

Werner

Edgelord.

Sun

6 day(s) ago

Oh wise wizard: Is contemporary PHILOSOPHY a joke? You must be joking.

Nicolai

4 day(s) ago

Joseph here.

Alice Dreger said it well: 'I am a woman. I am not interested in "being believed." I am interested in being taken seriously.'

For too long women who claim to have been treated with sexual impropriety by men have not been taken seriously enough. "Believe women" is a crude and simplistic over-correction. Instead, take their claims seriously and assess them on their own merits.


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